• Questy@lemmy.world
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    1 month ago

    Since I don’t see much football stuff on Lemmy, this is Mohammed Salah, an Egyptian footballer and premier league royalty. YNWA

    • geneva_convenience@lemmy.mlOP
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      1 month ago

      The Muslims conquered land and replaced its government, they did not murder and replace their entire population. This is why countries like Somalia are filled with black people who are Muslims and not Arabs.

      Mohamed Salah has Egyptian ancestry. He is not a random Arab Muslim claiming that Egypt was Arab.

      Settler colonization and replacing everything with ‘superior white people’ is a rather modern European tradion

        • geneva_convenience@lemmy.mlOP
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          1 month ago

          There are multiple forms of colonialism. The term settler colonialism’ is relatively new.

          Settler colonialism is a logic and structure of displacement by settlers, using colonial rule, over an environment for replacing it and its indigenous peoples with settlements and the society of the settlers.

          Practically every example you will find is Europeans getting on a boat and killing natives. The most famous example is Manifest Destiny also known as America.

  • MonkderVierte@lemmy.ml
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    1 month ago

    Isn’t the idea of museums that you can learn about other cultures without going there?

  • BellaDonna
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    1 month ago

    Honestly the concept of property here is just silly. Who specifically do they belong to, why, what claim, and how could such a claim exist?

    I just don’t agree with the concept, this individual doesn’t have any right to ownership regardless of whether his specific family owned it at some point prior, but most likely a direct relative doesn’t even own it, just someone with his self same ‘race’ ( which race doesn’t really exist either tbh, not genetically anyway, but exists as a social construct ).

    I just despise this mentality. I don’t own anything collectively with anyone of my ‘race’, neither their achievements nor shames, and same for even direct relatives.

    There is not enough generic diversity in humans to even prop up the idea of race beyond being a cultural construct, it’s time to stop seeing our fellow humans as something other.

    • Dessalines@lemmy.ml
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      1 month ago

      Property rights only exist when non-western countries want their stuff / land back. When the west stole them, then its finders keepers.

      /s

    • MeowZedong@lemmygrad.ml
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      1 month ago

      The phrasing was weird, but this guy was born in Egypt and the statue was taken from Egypt. This isn’t a matter of private property, he’s commenting on how the UK exploited Egypt.

      Sure, race and nationality are social constructs and genetics don’t support the divisions we make along phenotypic lines, however, you can’t just hope to solve racism and colonialism by saying they are gone and meaningless. If you say they no longer exist, that doesn’t erase the impacts racism and colonialism have had on a people.

      In essence, it’s like punching someone repeatedly until they are bloody, stealing the money from their wallet to buy yourself a house, and then saying, “why can’t we forget our differences and just be friends?” Is everything alright? Is it ok that you now have a home and the other person is destitute because you stole their money? Does it make it any better if it was your parents or grandparents who did this and now you’ve inherited the house?

      Just claiming it’s a social construct and wiping your hands of the issue does not fix the problem. And that metaphor I made does not even encompass the entire issue! Reality is more along the lines of: now that you own this house, you enforce policies that continually raise the price of housing and put a tax on people who don’t own a house. The exploitation many people have suffered at the hands of racism and colonialism never stopped, it just changed it’s form.

  • linkhidalgogato@lemmy.ml
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    1 month ago

    funny for an Egyptian man to say this, considering that it was made by black people not Arabs. If such things went by blood then and culture then South Sudan would have the strongest claim to it, its like saying that art by ancient indigenous americans belongs to an amerikkkan only difference is time.

    • 50_centavos@lemmy.world
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      1 month ago

      Just because Egypt is in Africa doesn’t automatically make Egyptians black. Look at a map. Northern Africa and Egypt were just as much part of southern Europe and the Middle East.

      • captainlezbian@lemmy.world
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        1 month ago

        Hell look at the written records of the pharaohs. Ramseses II (Ozymendias, of King of kings, look upon his works all ye mighty and despair fame) reasserted control of Canaan and Phoenicia, led military campaigns into Syria and the Levant, and also led expeditions into Nubia. That indicates a clearly more established connection to the Middle East than to elsewhere in Africa at the height of ancient Egypt (height of the new kingdom).

      • linkhidalgogato@lemmy.ml
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        1 month ago

        except that Egyptians were black some 4000 years ago, 2000 years for upper Egypt, it is quite literally named the “land of the blacks” after all that is what Egypt means, latter ancient civilizations in lower Egypt were not black and eventually upper Egypt too because of migration from Asia and Europe which in turn created migrations of the then Egyptians into at first upper Egypt and then Ethiopia and Sudan. Almost the entirety of what people think of when they think of “ancient Egypt” was made by black people not all but most.

        • GreenKnight23@lemmy.world
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          1 month ago

          someone got their Egyptology degree from Queen Cleopatra.

          Egypt was actually pretty well mixed between lower Saharan Africans, Greeks, Turks, etc. that’s because Egypt was a trusted trade route between many successful economies around the Mediterranean sea.

    • Entropywins@lemmy.world
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      1 month ago

      Is this an ancient Kush statue or am I missing something? I don’t believe upper ancient Egypt would be considered modern Sudan. Also DNA evidence from Egyptian mummies show little to no sub saharan DNA in them. How did you learn this information?

      • linkhidalgogato@lemmy.ml
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        1 month ago

        i agree i just think its interesting considering the history of ancient Egypt. which is why i said IF such things went by culture and blood.

    • linkhidalgogato@lemmy.ml
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      1 month ago

      except that not actually an other hand sorta thing at all, almost exclusively it was colonizers and their wars that destroyed so many of the artifacts that werent stolen, if they weren’t delivery destroyed by colonizers to erase history and beyond even that the colonizers carelessness, greed, and racism which they brought to archeology led to much more than just artifacts being destroyed. There are so many historical sites whose histories we will never know at all because these clown excavated them to take “relics” and took little if any records where their precious artifacts were found and how, and that is if sites were not destroyed in their entirety out of sheer idiocy in the search of something else like how troy was. 18th, 19th, and even some 20th century so called archeology is a history of the destruction of history.

      • 50_centavos@lemmy.world
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        1 month ago

        Holy run-on sentences. I agree with you, but it was done, it’s already in the museums. Signing petitions and raising awareness of agencies/museums that are trying to get the stuff back is probably a better way to funnel your frustrations.

    • Z3k3@lemmy.world
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      1 month ago

      That’s an interesting point. While I agree it’s kinda shitty the UK nicked everyone’s cool stuff and shoved it in 1 building. I’m willing to bet if we hadn’t the number of pieces that would be lost to time would not be zero

      • Madison420@lemmy.world
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        1 month ago

        This is just weird revisionist history. They moved in stole shit, colonized and murdered. The after the fact excuse of “we took it to preserve it” doesn’t play mostly because their colonizer bullshit is largely the reason areas they stole shit from are destabilized.

        • Z3k3@lemmy.world
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          1 month ago

          I’m not revising anything its a shitty thing to do and it should all be returned. It was just a thought with a beer given how volatile some of the areas where the stuff comes and yes I know most of them ended up volatile because of colonialism.

      • Jilanico@lemmy.world
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        1 month ago

        Yeah I’m totally sure the Brits didn’t break a single thing shipping artifacts to their big fancy museum. Let’s ignore all the mummies Europeans ground up into powder and ingested as “medicine”. Savagely eating dead humans with the same mouths that say brown people are too savage to take care of their own artifacts.