• VeryVito@lemmy.ml
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    3 days ago

    I understand the point, but as an exercise, try to find four historical figures without glaring character defects. Eventually, I figure we’ll all be either judged or forgotten in time.

    • PolandIsAStateOfMind@lemmy.ml
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      3 days ago

      Yeah every political leader have little oopsies like being called “town destroyer” by the people which land they invaded and towns they destroyed. They also were proud of it, used it to invade even more land, and their grandpas were also called that because it’s their family and nation thing to do for generations.

    • acargitz@lemmy.ca
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      2 days ago

      I dunno Barack Obama and Jimmy Carter, seem to have been personally good people. That’s two recent US presidents. Then I guess I would add some super low hanging fruit like Nelson Mandela, Frederick the Great, John II Komnenos, any of the Five Good Emperors, Cyrus the Great, Ashoka, and one could keep going.

      EDIT: To all those pestering me about how US presidents presided over criminal imperialist policies, here is my answer from down below:

      OP talked about “glaring character defects”.

      These are policy failures and state crimes, arguably attributed to the American state as a whole, and the long term US imperialist policies, rather to the singular person of the president.

      You might have noticed that I added Frederick the Great in the list, which tells you exactly what my understanding of the challenge was.

      I’m not here to defend US imperialism, don’t @ me.

        • Zerush@lemmy.ml
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          2 days ago

          Without the US, the world would be much more peaceful today, most of the current wars and terrorisms are caused by US interventions, directly and indirectly.

        • CaptPretentious@lemmy.world
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          2 days ago

          That is an incredible list. Did a find for a few things I personally knew about and have always been disappointed in Obama for… and sure enough found them. First one I searched, was extending the Bush tax cuts on the rich. I remember Bill O’Reilly saying “Oh, if I have to pay taxes, I’m going to have to fire people, and that’s on Obama, so tax cuts means less jobs!” (so glad Bill got canned) and Obama just fucking caved like a spineless coward.

      • Packet@lemmy.ml
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        2 days ago

        Obama?? Obama??? The Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya Obama? You must be joking, right?

        • acargitz@lemmy.ca
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          2 days ago

          OP talked about “glaring character defects”.

          These are policy failures and state crimes, arguably attributed to the American state as a whole, and the long term US imperialist policies, rather to the singular person of the president.

          You might have noticed that I added Frederick the Great in the list, which tells you exactly what my understanding of the challenge was.

      • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
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        2 days ago

        Carter supported Pol Pot and Obama was a monster to people in the Middle East, neither can be considered to be “good people.”

      • jacksilver@lemmy.world
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        2 days ago

        I mean we absolutely could call out their flaws too, someone with that much power/responsibility is going to do abhorrent things (drone strikes with Obama being an easy one to bring up). Just like the four on Mount Rushmore these things aren’t what we typically call out because they either were “of the times” or not on the same scale as their accomplishments.

        • Stern@lemmy.world
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          2 days ago

          They called Obama the Deporter in Chief. Trump wishes he could get a nickname like that. Carter himself was a nice guy but his below average presidency led to Reagan.